He wanted the One Ring. This increased his corruption, though he never lost the possibility of becoming independent with the One Ring. This mod, although it doesn't add a new staff to the game, creates a unique design for all of the Skyrim staves. Well Gandalf and Galadriel were pretty confident in their ability to defeat Sauron using One Ring! My own feeling is that since it takes time to learn to master the Ring (also Letter 246), Sauron would have had to pay a visit immediately and before Saruman had the time to achieve this mastery. Did Peter Jackson take inspiration for Gollum from "Dracula 1931" movie. Luckily, Gandalf refused, and the rest of the trilogy didn't play out in Saruman's favor. For The War of the Rohirrim anime, one answer might draw on the "canon" of the Peter Jackson films. Since Sauruman was once justly revered as among the great, by such as Elrond, and even Gandalf, it seems that he might well have been able to use the ring against Sauron successfully. With the more powerful becoming all the more corrupted. What would happen if Gandalf had the ring? So if Saruman mastered the Ring, he would become the next Dark Lord of Middle-earth. He wanted the One Ring. Short story taking place on a toroidal planet or moon involving flying, Acidity of alcohols and basicity of amines, The difference between the phonemes /p/ and /b/ in Japanese, Replacing broken pins/legs on a DIP IC package. The one ring would have made him more like what he was before he left on his mission to middle-earth, only corrupted and evil. https://www.teespring.com/stores/historyoftheagesAlso here are our other social media links too! In the hypothetic situation where Sauron thought, or knew, that Saruman had the Ring, I think he would have responded in a similar way. It does not store any personal data. Gil Galad, and the last alliance also defeated Sauron, without the help of the Maiar, as well. Saruman summon the storm on Caradhras in the PJverse in The Fellowship of the Ring. Soon (convenient term, soon) I will begin on the second volume of The Lord of the Rings, The Two Towers.It consists of two 'books', The Treason of Isengard and The Ring Goes East.The first 'book' of the volume deals with the adventures of Aragorn, Gimli, and Legolas as they go in search of Merry and Pippin; this puts them all in conflict with the traitorous wizard Saruman's machinations. In this scenario, Sauron likely would have recovered his Ring and covered all the lands in a second darkness. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. (OK, just a Numenorean with the largest army and navy in all of history.) What did Tolkien originally write? Ap. Come join us to discuss the works of Tolkien. Even some of the imagery in his scenes screams Gandalf. Sauron originally made the One Ring to enhance his ability to influence and suppress or control the wills of other beings, specifically the Children of Ilvatar (Elves, Dwarves, and Men). What TV series related to the "Matter of Middle-earth" would you prefer to see? Was he not already the warlord of a growing realm, a commander of orcs and men? This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. It was his own and under his will. Lucky hit or not, he was vulnerable to a mere sword with no great magical ability or anything displayed that showed the ring as some huge magnifier of magical ability. Basically it took a super-human with a super-sword to chop the ring off of Sauron's hand and he only did that with a lucky hit. Tolkiens trilogy its even plastered on the cover of several editions of the books. Chief among the powers of the ring that were feared by the White Council was the fact that if Sauron put it on now, all that had been done by the Wise using the three rings would be revealed to him, as would their minds, if they did not take off the rings. He'd have used his bird spies to scour the area and sent out Uruks on wargs and men on horses. He is Maiar. " The Hunt for the Ring " is a chapter in Unfinished Tales, a posthumously published work of J.R.R. Saruman himself is not directly involved, and only appears again in chapter 10, The Voice of Saruman, by which time he is trapped in Orthanc. He fought Uruk-hai (who had captured Merry and Pippin thinking they were Frodo) and were enroute to Isengard. Feel free to contact him by email at [email protected], or find him on Facebook. [ST:TNG] The First Duty what if there had been no accident? How successful would Saruman be finding and capturing the Ringbearer in this scenario is speculative but one has to wonder would Sauron not notice this activity. And in The Rings of Power, when the . I would think that Saruman, a Maia, would be in that category. Powered by Discourse, best viewed with JavaScript enabled. Any idea what set any of these are from? Then Sauron would have had the ring again and either he'd keep Saruman as a servant or just get rid of him for trying to be his equal. Will to conquer all life in Middle-earth was the last bit I believe. You are using an out of date browser. Even though Frodo had a 4-5 day head-start further east and would be entering the Dead Marshes on March 1st, Saruman would also have had a head-start on everyone else in terms of knowledge and certainty. Is Taco Bell healthier than other fast food? Which routine is best for gaining muscle? Saruman didn't know what Gandalf wanted to say, but he could guess. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. When the good wizard Saruman uses one to spy on the peoples of Middle-earth, he is drawn in by its power and ensnared by . Gandalf wasn't even sure if he would be able to break his staff in The Return of the King, and that was a very weakened version of Saruman. In The Lord of the Rings, the palantri corrupt nearly all who use them. Thank you! Sarumaon told Gandalf that a new power was rising and noone could srand and therefore they should join that power. The Lord of the Rings is one of the best series of three fantasy adventure films, The Fellowship of the Ring (2001), The Two Towers (2002), and The Return of the King (2003), directed by Peter Jackson, based on the novel which was written by J. R. R. Tolkien.The series is widely regarded as the greatest and the most influential, it was also a huge success financially and is among the highest . His three friends were smiling at him, but Gandalf was only managing an embarrassed smile towards the Lady. In his mind, it was the only logical thing to do, and he offered Gandalf a place by his side. Sauron w. Saruman later describes himself as "Ring-maker" when taunting Gandalf. However, that's not the most likely scenario. Blake Hawkins has written TV and movie features and recaps for CBR since March of 2021. That's information that either could potentially use to tip the balance, but perhaps Saruman would also have had awareness that a contest with Sauron was one that he couldn't possibly win? And hes got a considerable stronghold and force of arms with which to hold off Saurons forces until he can learn to use it. These are not some sort of machine gun, or beam weapon that is just leveled at the enemy, by anyone who happens to wear them. Even if Saruman won this hypothetical battle, it would be ultimately irrelevant. By the time we meet Saruman in The Lord of the Rings, hes up to no good. I'm a little vague on this point. It allowed him to recover multiple times after his physical body got destroyed. One can imagine The greatest act of disobedience in LOTR had possibly the greatest consequences which in the end saved the Quest of the Ring and saved Middle-Earth that being Eomer's act of disobedience. Had Isuldur done the wise thing, and pitched that sucker in the crack of doom, that would have been it. The Three were used against Sauron, but indirectly. IIRC the idea of Galadriel taking it scared the bejeezus out of him. But eventually the Ring would subvert their efforts and bring about evil. If not for Gandalf, Gondor might've fallen to Sauron. He writes about everything from NCIS to Stranger Things to The Walking Dead and everything in between. Would the One Ring even work for anyone but Sauron? The White Wizard -- at the height of his power -- could have been a match for the Ringless Dark Lord. After that there is no other mention of Aragorn and the Ring together. He definitely volunteered to go to Middle-earth first. Saruman had full control of his army, which is why the Hobbits were being brought to him (because they maybe had the ring), instead of immediately to Sauron (who at the time of their capture, they were much closer to). ncdu: What's going on with this second size column? Why does Gandalf seek counsel from Saruman about the One Ring after leaving Frodo in the Shire? Other powerul magic users such as Galadriel, Gandalf & Saruman can use the Ring to increase their power as that is what it was forged by Sauron to do, but it will never truly be completely under their will because Sauron's evil will already exists in the Ring. I got down on bended knee at the top of the mountain and proposed. A couple of points to add to the excellent arguments thus far: This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register. Plus, if the Stranger is Saruman, it also makes Gandalfs journey and decisions all the more important and emphasizes an ongoing theme in Tolkiens works: every being has the power to choose between good and evil, or selflessness vs. selfishness. Sauron then spends the rest of his life torturing Saruman for daring to try and take the ring for himself. What if the Stranger is Saruman? By clicking Post Your Answer, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy. This just had to be the best designed set, even better than the 2017 UCS Millennium Falcon! What If SARUMAN managed to get his hands on the One Ring and how that effects all events afterwards! Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for LEGO The Lord of the Rings Tower of Orthanc (10237) at the best online prices at eBay! On the other hand, Sauron was not invincible either. But opting out of some of these cookies may affect your browsing experience. It may not display this or other websites correctly. Orcs are poster children for corruption, and plague the Fellowship throughout the novels. The thing is, that wouldn't be a simple task. Sauron would then have suspended his campaign against Minas Tirith, and instead sent his armies north-west, through Rohan towards Isengard. Gandalf - open displays of power versus his restrictions as an Istar. Is the man a thousand times stronger than a normal man? He did not fear Sauron, but rather was forbidden to contest with him directly. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. When he saw Aragorn marching on the Black Gate, he was afraid. Why are physically impossible and logically impossible concepts considered separate in terms of probability? Sauron may not learn the true goal of the Ringbearer but he would know that the ringbearer was most likely near or nearing his borders. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. Would Sauron be able to open two fronts, battling against Isengard and Gondor? Is Bosnia a developing or developed country? However, you may visit "Cookie Settings" to provide a controlled consent. its forging) to end (the . The Eye of Sauron is one of the most iconic symbols associated with J.R.R. Loyalty is an important theme in Tolkien's world and obedience to authority is paramount in a medieval setting as in Middle-Earth. Probably, upon creation, Saruman was weaker than Gandalf and Sauron, and he spent his entire existence trying to increase his power, leading to his jealousy of Gandalf and eventual betrayal. A Saruman prequel, an Aragorn spin-off and a Gandalf v the Necromancer thriller could all lead up to the fateful hunt of Gollum and the events immediately preceding the Lord of the Rings (with . When Gandalf sent Frodo and the Hobbits to Bree in The Lord of the Rings' opening act, he had the fullest intent of meeting them there. If Saruman masters the ring, he will have a chance of defeating Sauron. That's when the Rohirrim attacked, allowing the Hobbits to escape into Fangorn forest. Science Fiction & Fantasy Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for science fiction and fantasy enthusiasts. Follow her on Twitter and Instagram. He aided Frodo but he did not save him or the Quest from certain ruin as Eomer did by attacking the orc band. Why are Suriname, Belize, and Guinea-Bissau classified as "Small Island Developing States"? The Lord of the Rings; Middle-Earth (Franchise) entertainment news When Gandalf meets Saruman in Orthanc, he notices that Saruman is wearing a ring. But if Eomer hadn't disobeyed orders? But he didn't because Eomer disobeyed his king and destroyed an orc band that had the most crucial thing needed by both Saruman and Sauron - information. But it will still never truly be his & he will have to continually fight to dominate it as the One Ring wants to return to its master, who cannot be banished until the Ring is destroyed. Furthermore, Saruman knows more about ring-lore than any other being in Middle Earth at the time, save only Sauron himself, and he had already made himself a minor ring, so he would learn how to use it quickly. Still, this is a point to consider. The power they have is to give stature to the wearer in the minds of others, and to enhance the emotional strength of the wearer, in the manner desired by their maker. Why does Gollum calling the ring his own not alert Sauron? In Tolkiens work, Saruman went to Rhn, shortly after he arrived in Middle-earth, in factjust like the Stranger. You would have both Saruman and Sauron focused in the same area and it is very unlikely Frodo would have escaped that level of scrutiny even with Gollum leading him on secret paths. Anybody else who bore it (non-stop) would eventually be drawn to him, where he would get the Ring back. The question of what Saruman would have done therefore becomes moot since it seems inevitable that Sauron would have been the stronger. I mean, he was supposed to be powerful ANYWAY was he not? By clicking Accept All, you consent to the use of ALL the cookies. When Sauron thought Aragorn had the Ring, he reacted with a swift military offensive. The Uruk-hai capture Frodo and Sam at Amon Hen, thus Saruman gains possession of the most powerful of the Rings of Power, which carries in it, a greater part of Sauron's inherent might. Doom to be destroyed and not taken to be used by some great leader. Are there tables of wastage rates for different fruit and veg? If the Uruk Army sent by Saruman had captured Frodo and had gotten the One Ring to Saruman, what would Saruman have done with it? He would soon surmise Saruman didn't have the Ring and the two halflings were ringers. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. It seems it was a mistake for the Ring to leave Isildur. Could he really do anything with it? Does this sword yield more power than the ring? It's possible Saruman would have been able to defeat Sauron. )https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCScfG2CfbSh_LUzkGJ_p-aAHistory of Dragon Ball - (For all things Dragon Ball! The best answers are voted up and rise to the top, Not the answer you're looking for? His own greed and lust for power turned him to darkness on his own, and Sauron through the Palantir had already turned Saruman into his tool - though Saruman was of no use to Sauron at all once defeated. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. Out of these, the cookies that are categorized as necessary are stored on your browser as they are essential for the working of basic functionalities of the website. House of Dragons vs. Why Did Eru Give Men The Gift Of Death And Not to The Elves too? The Lord of the Rings. Two Maiar duking it out at their full strength would have brought ruin to much of Middle-earth, and that was exactly what the Valar had hoped to avoid in the first place. However, Saruman had planned his rise to power much earlier than that. 2) Saurman is defeated by Sauron and the ring is taken from him, destroying Saruman's mind. Tolkein himself said that it would have been a difficult battle, and might have gone either way, but that One of the true great powers could have dedfeated Sauron by using the Ring. Balrogs are intelligent sentient beings. He and his servants already knew of his involvement in the attack on the Fellowship and the capture of the hobbits. Saruman would have made a tasty little morsel for Sauron. On the surface, Saruman seems like one of the simplest Lord of the Rings characters to define. Exactly. Sauron is the primary villain of The Lord Of The Rings. Does he use his great voice, enhanced by the One to subjugate the free peoples. Earlier in the same letter we see just exactly how useful the Ring would have been to a hypothetical Ring-bearing Saruman (or anyone else, for that matter): Sauron would not have feared the Ring! Some interesting conjecture, but you're forgetting that if anyone replaced Sauron as the "master" of the One Ruling Ring, they would sever Sauron's tie to the ring and essentially reduce him to an ineffectual spirit who could no longer interact with the physical world. They got the identity wrong, but the Stranger felt the direction about Rhn to be accurate. Saruman was corrupted already so was a good candidate for the One Ring, through him it could exert Sauron's will to enslave all Middle-earth. Gandalf found out that Saruman had abandoned his mission when the White Wizard asked him to join forces with Sauron. )https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCpgaqH-cKuqvfKr1NL-yudg-----Don't forget to check out our Official website!www.thebrokensword.co.ukIf you want to support the channel, you can help us on our Patreon page. Although this is never explicitly stated, Galadriel alluded to the Fact that Gandalf, . The first thing you need to realize is just how long a gap there was between the two trilogies. vegan) just to try it, does this inconvenience the caterers and staff? There's this passage that describes what happened after the death of his physical body: To the dismay of those that stood by, about the body of Saruman a grey mist gathered, and rising slowly to a great height like smoke from a fire, as a pale shrouded figure it loomed over the Hill. The Rise Of LOTR's Witch-king Of Angmar. We know of his ultimate betrayal against Middle-earth, maybe especially against his fellow Wizards and the Valar. How to show that an expression of a finite type must be one of the finitely many possible values? First off, it gives us an idea of how dangerous the Ring is- if the head of the Istari and White Council can . Although they did oppose the will of Sauron, while he did not have the one, they were still subject to his will, if he regained it, and all that had been done with them would be revealed. mostly minifigs and decorated bricks. JavaScript is disabled. He reasoned that his total control of Middle . What would have happened if Saruman got the ring? What money is available for senior citizens? Sauron would also realize the captured Halflings did not have the Ring so all the doubt surrounding Aragorn having it would be absent. This perfectly explained how the Ring could have gotten from Sauron to Isildur to Gollum to . He caught up with the orcs and destroyed them in the early hours of the 29th. Why are non-Western countries siding with China in the UN? But what would have happened if things had worked out differently? So it is my assumption that Saruman wanted the One Ring so he could forge his own Ring of Power. But I've been thinking. 2 What would happen if Gandalf had the ring? . Even still, Frodo set the benchmark for hope and volunteered to take the One Ring to Mordor, where he destroyed it and saved the world from disaster. Also, it says in the book that the Nazgul went to Isengard demanding news of the ring and if Sauraman had the ring, Sauraman said if I had the ring you would bow down to me and call me lord I think Saruman would've won if he captured the ring. Saruman wants to be Sauron's . The cookie is set by GDPR cookie consent to record the user consent for the cookies in the category "Functional". Gandalf was hand-selected and sent by Manw. The Vanyar were one of the tribes/families of the elves. What can a lawyer do if the client wants him to be acquitted of everything despite serious evidence? Got caught and lost a mind-to-mind battle. Nori even said in the finale that the Stranger was there to help. Imagine that, after breaking of Fellowship, Saruman`s Uruk-Hai capture Frodo and bring him, with the ring, to Isengard. In the appendices it mentions the three assaults on Lorien, during the final days of the struggle. That he will never do now." Saruman with the Ring would presumably have tried to do what Tolkien says Galadriel or Gandalf might have done, if they have succumbed to the temptation of accepting the Ring: (Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age, The Silmarillion as far as the quoted material here goes). Both the direct and symbolic aspects could have helped Saruman expand his empire by winning adherents and frightening potential opponents. Sauron was the Dark Lord in The Lord of the Rings saga, written by J.R.R. Well? Would Saruman have been able to defeat Sauron with the power of the One Ring? When Gandalf returned and revealed himself to Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas in Fangorn he said something to the effect of "in a way I'm now Saruman, but you can keep calling me Gandalf." First of all: Yes, you probably should watch at least The Two Towers before reading much further: that movie is all about Saruman's plans and schemes.. Having said that, there's a combination of things that have driven Saruman to act the way he does in the Lord of the Rings trilogy. Saruman was known for being subtle in speech (with a powerful ability to sway others with his voice) and skilled in smithcraft. If you know how to use it, its an *extremely* powerful magical artifact. Hes lost his way in a search for greater power. Today we jump back in time to one of our older videos at one of our What If scenarios! Saruman wasnt an elf, or even a man. Even from afar he had an effect upon it, to make it work for its return to himself. 5 Who controlled the Seeing Stone of Minas Anor? Anybody else who bore it (non-stop) would eventually be drawn to him, where he would get the Ring back. 1 What would have happened if Saruman got the ring? I think Saruman would have kept the Ring and used its real and symbolic powers to contest with Sauron for control over Middle-earth by building up his own empire. After all, he was extremely powerful in his own right. He now lives with his family in Lynchburg VA and is an avid outdoorsman. Saruman had decided to abandon his mission as an Istari and join Sauron in subjugating Middle-earth. Ummm, thats what the One Ring does for someone who has zero magical ability. There was a Winged Nazgul operating near the area as well on the other side of the Anduin and thus closer to Frodo. The cookie is used to store the user consent for the cookies in the category "Analytics". How might the Ring have helped Saruman in his empire-building? Even if Theoden triumphed at Helm's Deep in this scenario, Saruman would be relatively safe in Isengard and Aragorn would not be able to look into the Palantir which is what led Sauron to focus his attention in Aragorn's direction and not around his own borders. Please message us if we have not credited you! They could not fight him, since it was under Saurons power they were made, but they did distract him - Sauron was concentrating his sight and attantion upon Rivendell and Lothlorien. If he succeeded in doing that, Sauron would have been defeated because it was his saving anchor. If Saruman had taken and claimed the Ring for his own, Sauron would have been aware of it immediately. Saruman's power is that of influence, both in a political sense of his influence as the highest member of the council, but also in the sense of being able to have some control over other people . But why do I think the Stranger is Saruman? What if Saruman had never been corrupted? What is a word for the arcane equivalent of a monastery? Either way, Saruman through torture or his Voice would have quickly learned everything about the Quest of the Ring. That is, however, a legitimate concern when entering any fight: any weaponry you wield may be captured and used against you. A normal man with a normal sword would probably have failed miserably even if he had got in the lucky hit. Five wizards came to Middle-earth, so the Stranger could be any of them. We see this happening when Frodo claims the Ring at the Crack of Doom, and there's no reason to think it would be different for Saruman. I dont find it terribly exciting that Gandalf arrived in Middle-earth and was good from the beginning (with Noris help). Seem's strange when the ring's main purpose was to rule over the rings/leaders? Many of the vague abilities listed above are also part and parcel to those abilities listed below. These cookies ensure basic functionalities and security features of the website, anonymously. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. That success would be the usual bitter victory, though, because first the new wielder of the ring would need to build his own power, and learn the mastery of the ring. Like the Valar He was created in the Beginning. Rohan would've fallen to Saruman and wouldn't have been able to come to the aid of Gondor and helped make the final stand against the forces of Mordor at the Black Gate. The thing is, it's worth wondering what would have happened if Frodo had failed. This cookie is set by GDPR Cookie Consent plugin. These cookies will be stored in your browser only with your consent. What if: One of the primarch's had landed on the world of Avatar the Last Airbender. Why are trials on "Law & Order" in the New York Supreme Court? I say this because Saruman would never have destroyed the ring and so the ring would have eventually consumed him since Sauron was its true master. As mentioned, the Valar sent the Istari (who are Maiar spirits) to Middle-earth. Instead of sending armies out to take Minas Tirith, Sauron would have had the majority of his forces concentrated on his borders and sweeping the land in front of it with orcs, men, trolls, and Nazgul. If he could obtain or recreate the One Ring for himself, he would be able to rule Middle-earth just like Sauron did.
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